SnowLeopard Posted March 13, 2016 Report Share Posted March 13, 2016 I was messing around today and stumbled upon a strange, but very definitely broken layout occurring sometimes in the Trident mode. A brief summation is the flow is vertical where it should be horizontal first with vertical following. I have a series of screen shots from this forum, EWTN.com, and CBS.com. I also checked my other two main TV networks, aBC and NBC, but they . do not seem to be affected. CBS.com suffers a different effect from this foum and EWTN. I tried Trident with and without standard rendering and there was no difference. The Trident shots here are with standard rendering. Screen shots: Ultra mode (the way things should look) Trident Mode (broken) The CBS problem is similar to a problem I reported in 4.4.x series for Ultra Mode. Ultra mode was fixed. Now Trident has "caught" a similar bug. It would be a very good idea to figure out what's going on and fix these problems. I don't know what other sites might show this problem. I just found two layout problems and CBS with missing items in the header wrapper. <<SL>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted March 13, 2016 Report Share Posted March 13, 2016 the whole branch of 4.9 does strange things in trident mode with a couple of sites i visit - it comes and goes - graphics not loaded and then fine the next time - i commented on it somewhere but it never got a reply so forgot about it and went back to 4.4 which is solid Tony - Vivaldi 4 on Windows 10 64Bit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 13, 2016 Report Share Posted March 13, 2016 5 hours ago, SnowLeopard said: I was messing around today and stumbled upon a strange, but very definitely broken layout occurring sometimes in the Trident mode. A brief summation is the flow is vertical where it should be horizontal first with vertical following. I have a series of screen shots from this forum, EWTN.com, and CBS.com. I also checked my other two main TV networks, aBC and NBC, but they . do not seem to be affected. CBS.com suffers a different effect from this foum and EWTN. I tried Trident with and without standard rendering and there was no difference. The Trident shots here are with standard rendering. Screen shots: Ultra mode (the way things should look) The CBS problem is similar to a problem I reported in 4.4.x series for Ultra Mode. Ultra mode was fixed. Now Trident has "caught" a similar bug. It would be a very good idea to figure out what's going on and fix these problems. I don't know what other sites might show this problem. I just found two layout problems and CBS with missing items in the header wrapper. <<SL>> Uhm, it's trident. Which OS are you using? Nothing Maxthon can do other than tell you to switch OS...use standard rendering mode or don't. My settings, standard rendering on win10 or you can listen to tony and get the same problems with 4.4... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pantantrollo Posted March 14, 2016 Report Share Posted March 14, 2016 Well here , with maxthon 4.9.2.3000 beta and trident on windows 10 64bits Un Saludo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowLeopard Posted March 14, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2016 2 minutes ago, pantantrollo said: Well here , with maxthon 4.9.2.3000 beta and trident on windows 10 64bits Un Saludo Well thast's good for Win10. Which browser IE ?? or Edge installed. I assume you have "standard rendering" enabled, right? But alas, I'm with Win7. Usually that hasn't been a problem. <<SL>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pantantrollo Posted March 14, 2016 Report Share Posted March 14, 2016 15 minutes ago, SnowLeopard said: Well thast's good for Win10. Which browser IE ?? or Edge installed. I assume you have "standard rendering" enabled, right? But alas, I'm with Win7. Usually that hasn't been a problem. <<SL>> Sorry for my english I have IExplore v11,162 and Edge v25.10586 installed. (Windows 10 has the two explorers) In maxthon I have enabled "standard rendering" but if I turn off , the pages i see like activated Un Saludo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pantantrollo Posted March 14, 2016 Report Share Posted March 14, 2016 Sorry. I tried this same page forum and gives me error as SnowLeopard, with "standard rendering" enabled and disabled. Ultra mode Retro mode "standard rendering" enabled and disabled (same result) Un Saludo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 14, 2016 Report Share Posted March 14, 2016 49 minutes ago, pantantrollo said: Sorry. I tried this same page forum and gives me error as SnowLeopard, with "standard rendering" enabled and disabled. Ultra mode Retro mode "standard rendering" enabled and disabled (same result) Un Saludo I'm using win10build 14279, which are you using? You can see the mode I'm using in the image, I didn't photoshop, honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-ody- Posted March 14, 2016 Report Share Posted March 14, 2016 41 minutes ago, PHYR said: I'm using win10build 14279, which are you using? You can see the mode I'm using in the image, I didn't photoshop, honest. I have the same issue as posters above win 10 build 1511, no matter whether standard rendering mode is enabled or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pantantrollo Posted March 14, 2016 Report Share Posted March 14, 2016 56 minutes ago, PHYR said: I'm using win10build 14279, which are you using? You can see the mode I'm using in the image, I didn't photoshop, honest. Windows 10 [Version 6.3.10586] 64bits (Castellano) = W10 build 1151 Ultra mode Retro mode "standard rendering" enabled and disabled (same result) Un Saludo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7twenty Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 I'm confused?! If sites are working in Ultra, why are you even bothering with Retro? It's there for compatibility, so if it's working fine in Ultra, Retro working or not is completely irrelevant. Unless you're using sites that were designed for browsers from ~2010, there's no reason to even try. The bigger problem these days is sites that require a current version of blink that break if certain features can't be used. As with PHYR, all sites display correctly in Retro with standard rendering (4.9.2.300) / Win10 1511. If it's not working with Retro (IE8 mode) it's because... get ready for it... it's trying to display a modern website with a 5yr old browser core!! 10 hours ago, SnowLeopard said: I'm with Win7 Which IE version? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 38 minutes ago, 7twenty said: I'm confused?! If sites are working in Ultra, why are you even bothering with Retro? It's there for compatibility, so if it's working fine in Ultra, Retro working or not is completely irrelevant. Unless you're using sites that were designed for browsers from ~2010, there's no reason to even try. The bigger problem these days is sites that require a current version of blink that break if certain features can't be used. As with PHYR, all sites display correctly in Retro with standard rendering (4.9.2.300) / Win10 1511. If it's not working with Retro (IE8 mode) it's because... get ready for it... it's trying to display a modern website with a 5yr old browser core!! Which browser version? In thew thread title, 4.9.2.300 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7twenty Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 3 minutes ago, PHYR said: In thew thread title, 4.9.2.300 I meant what IE version. Have updated post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 31 minutes ago, 7twenty said: I meant what IE version. Have updated post. Hmmm, is m4.9 using edgehtml? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-ody- Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 1 hour ago, 7twenty said: I meant what IE version. Have updated post. either edge or IE11 (windows 10) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 Just now, -ody- said: either edge or IE11 (windows 10) You look like a little witch to me, not a snowleopard :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-ody- Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 Just now, PHYR said: You look like a little witch to me, not a snowleopard :) although in this particular case I have the same issue ... http://forum.maxthon.com/index.php?/topic/19221-trident-layout-broken-492300-beta-release/&do=findComment&comment=99423 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 13 minutes ago, -ody- said: although in this particular case I have the same issue ... http://forum.maxthon.com/index.php?/topic/19221-trident-layout-broken-492300-beta-release/&do=findComment&comment=99423 These are some of the important updates to build 14267, it's very possibly the reason: 14.14267 31.14267 Web Notifications, WebRTC 1.0, improved HTML5, CSS3 and ECMAScript 6 and 7 support. It would not however explain 7twenty's results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7twenty Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 48 minutes ago, PHYR said: Hmmm, is m4.9 using edgehtml? No. There's nothing in the about > settings dialog that seems to refer to EdgeHTML. The IE version listed is that of IE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-ody- Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 @PHYR you're right : it takes a reboot to work, when standard rendering mode is enabled it works fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 2 minutes ago, -ody- said: @PHYR you're right : it takes a reboot to work, when standard rendering mode is enabled it works fine I deleted the post, but good. I think this might have been in advanced settings in 4.4(which needed reboot), but should be mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowLeopard Posted March 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 18 hours ago, 7twenty said: I'm confused?! If sites are working in Ultra, why are you even bothering with Retro? It's there for compatibility, so if it's working fine in Ultra, Retro working or not is completely irrelevant. Unless you're using sites that were designed for browsers from ~2010, there's no reason to even try. The bigger problem these days is sites that require a current version of blink that break if certain features can't be used. As with PHYR, all sites display correctly in Retro with standard rendering (4.9.2.300) / Win10 1511. If it's not working with Retro (IE8 mode) it's because... get ready for it... it's trying to display a modern website with a 5yr old browser core!! Which IE version? IE 11. I am under the imprssion that "standard rendering" uses the rendering engine in the installed version of IE. Is that incorrect? Here's the UA that IE 11 broadcasts: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; Win64; x64; Trident/7.0; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; SLCC2; .NET CLR 3.5.30729; .NET CLR 3.0.30729; .NET4.0C; .NET4.0E; rv:11.0) like Gecko <<SL>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 Well I'll be, this is mine on win10 b14279: M4.9.2.300ultra Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Maxthon/4.9.2.300 Chrome/39.0.2146.0 Safari/537.36 M4.9.2.300 retro Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; Trident/7.0; rv:11.0) like Gecko Trident/7.0 indicates that it is indeed using the edgehtml version of trident. hehe This is wrongTrident/7 is IE's version of Trident where Edge/14.xxxx is the new engine sans activex, complient to W3C standards. exactly the same as on IE M4.4 UA while using standard rendering mode is: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; Trident/7.0; rv:11.0) like Gecko I'm guessing it's using compatibility view?????? and ultra mode Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/30.0.1599.101 Safari/537.36 I hope someone with a little more knowledge peeps in. Is M4.9 using Trident/7 and then switching to IE compatibility mode when needed? Edges UA is Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/46.0.2486.0 Safari/537.36 Edge/14.14279 Now I'm just confused. Why is Trident/7 showing on snowleopards win7(windows NT 6,1) Edit: So my take is that 4.4 was using WindowsNT6.3, same as Windows 8 where 4.9 is using windows10NT 10, windows 10 true renderer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7twenty Posted March 16, 2016 Report Share Posted March 16, 2016 Ok lets try and get this straight... MX uses blink in Ultra. The UA should be similar to this:Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Maxthon/4.9.2.300 Chrome/39.0.2146.0 Safari/537.36 MX uses Trident in Retro Mode (using IE8 compatibility mode when Standard Rendering is unchecked). The UA should be similar to this:Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; Trident/7.0; .NET4.0C; .NET4.0E) MX uses Trident in Retro (using latest IE version installed when Standard rendering is checked). The UA should be similar to this:Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; Trident/7.0; rv:11.0) like Gecko MX does not use EdgeHTML Trident/7.0 = IE11 Ultra = Blink Retro = Trident Trident can run in: Compatibility Mode (IE8) when standard rendering is unchecked Default rendering mode (latest IE version installed) when standard rendering is checked You MUST restart Maxthon after changing the Standard Rendering option, otherwise nothing changes. -- So, the reason SnowLeopards images show the sites rendering wrong is because he's using compatibility mode (IE8) not standard rendering (IE11) in Retro. You can double check this by testing the same sites in IE and adding the sites to the compatibility list. @SnowLeopard maybe try this before this all gets more complicated than what it already has. 5 hours ago, PHYR said: Now I'm just confused. Why is Trident/7 showing on snowleopards win7(windows NT 6,1) Because he has IE11 installed - see above. The Windows xx.x part has nothing to do with anything - see below. 5 hours ago, PHYR said: Edit: So my take is that 4.4 was using WindowsNT6.3, same as Windows 8 where 4.9 is using windows10NT 10, windows 10 true renderer. The "Windows NT xx.x" only refers to the windows version - nothing to do with the renderer. Windows 10 reports v6.3 to those programs that are unable to correctly deal with NT10, as a means of backwards compatibility with the OS. -- Hopefully that clears things up about UA's/Retro/standard rendering etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 16, 2016 Report Share Posted March 16, 2016 5 minutes ago, 7twenty said: Ok lets try and get this straight... MX uses blink in Ultra. The UA should be similar to this:Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Maxthon/4.9.2.300 Chrome/39.0.2146.0 Safari/537.36 MX uses Trident in Retro Mode (using IE8 compatibility mode when Standard Rendering is unchecked). The UA should be similar to this:Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; Trident/7.0; .NET4.0C; .NET4.0E) MX uses Trident in Retro (using latest IE version installed when Standard rendering is checked). The UA should be similar to this:Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; Trident/7.0; rv:11.0) like Gecko MX does not use EdgeHTML Trident/7.0 = IE11 You MUST restart Maxthon after changing the Standard Rendering option, otherwise nothing changes. So, the reason SnowLeopards images show the sites rendering wrong is because he's using compatibility mode (IE8) not standard rendering (IE11) in Retro. You can double check this by testing the same sites in IE and adding the sites to the compatibility list. @SnowLeopard maybe try this before this all gets more complicated than what it already has. Because he has IE11 installed - see above. The Windows xx.x part has nothing to do with anything - see below. The "Windows NT xx.x" only refers to the windows version - nothing to do with the renderer. Windows 10 reports v6.3 to those programs that are unable to correctly deal with NT10, as a means of backwards compatibility with the OS. -- Hopefully that clears things up about UA's/Retro/standard rendering etc. Fact remains that 4.4 wasn't identifying as NT10 in retro mode where 4.9 does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7twenty Posted March 16, 2016 Report Share Posted March 16, 2016 3 minutes ago, PHYR said: Fact remains that 4.4 wasn't identifying as NT10 in retro mode where 4.9 does. 1. that has no relevance to the issue. 2. See the reply to the last quote in my previous post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pantantrollo Posted March 16, 2016 Report Share Posted March 16, 2016 13 hours ago, 7twenty said: MX does not use EdgeHTML Trident/7.0 = IE11 Ultra = Blink Retro = Trident Trident can run in: Compatibility Mode (IE8) when standard rendering is unchecked Default rendering mode (latest IE version installed) when standard rendering is checked Thx for the clarification. 13 hours ago, 7twenty said: You MUST restart Maxthon after changing the Standard Rendering option, otherwise nothing changes. This must be notified in options Un Saludo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowLeopard Posted March 16, 2016 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2016 14 hours ago, 7twenty said: Ok lets try and get this straight... MX uses blink in Ultra. The UA should be similar to this:Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Maxthon/4.9.2.300 Chrome/39.0.2146.0 Safari/537.36 MX uses Trident in Retro Mode (using IE8 compatibility mode when Standard Rendering is unchecked). The UA should be similar to this:Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; Trident/7.0; .NET4.0C; .NET4.0E) MX uses Trident in Retro (using latest IE version installed when Standard rendering is checked). The UA should be similar to this:Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; Trident/7.0; rv:11.0) like Gecko MX does not use EdgeHTML Trident/7.0 = IE11 Ultra = Blink Retro = Trident Trident can run in: Compatibility Mode (IE8) when standard rendering is unchecked Default rendering mode (latest IE version installed) when standard rendering is checked You MUST restart Maxthon after changing the Standard Rendering option, otherwise nothing changes. -- So, the reason SnowLeopards images show the sites rendering wrong is because he's using compatibility mode (IE8) not standard rendering (IE11) in Retro. You can double check this by testing the same sites in IE and adding the sites to the compatibility list. @SnowLeopard maybe try this before this all gets more complicated than what it already has. Because he has IE11 installed - see above. The Windows xx.x part has nothing to do with anything - see below. The "Windows NT xx.x" only refers to the windows version - nothing to do with the renderer. Windows 10 reports v6.3 to those programs that are unable to correctly deal with NT10, as a means of backwards compatibility with the OS. -- Hopefully that clears things up about UA's/Retro/standard rendering etc. Unfortunately for the theory, the rendering is the same in both compatibility mode and standard rendering. Also the screen shots were taken in standard rendering mode. I think I included that in my first post; if not, sorry. someone mentioned in the htread "what difference does it make when Ultra mode works as intended?" I'm posting because I'm a little bit perfectionist. A malfunctioning broswer in any mode of operation is bad PR at least. <<SL>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHYR Posted March 16, 2016 Report Share Posted March 16, 2016 1 hour ago, SnowLeopard said: I'm posting because I'm a little bit perfectionist. A malfunctioning broswer in any mode of operation is bad PR at least. <<SL>> The purpose of dual rendering engines is to address issues that arise on older sites. If those issues didn't exist there would be no purpose of having dual rendering engines. If your suggesting a single core browser be able to do both, for some reason, neither MS nor Google consider that feasible. Besides, in this case anyway, it isn't a browser issue but an OS one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7twenty Posted March 17, 2016 Report Share Posted March 17, 2016 9 hours ago, SnowLeopard said: Unfortunately for the theory, the rendering is the same in both compatibility mode and standard rendering. Also the screen shots were taken in standard rendering mode. I think I included that in my first post; if not, sorry. It's not a theory, it was tested over two systems (Win10 10586 & 14279), both with reproducible results. You did say it was std rendering, but with all due respect, i'm not going to believe that without some confirmation of a test with IE as mentioned above (where your name was tagged), and/or the UA's Maxthon is using when in Retro mode [compat & IE11]. In fact, just testing in IE11 should be enough. If for some reason IE11 on your system is showing the websites wrong, then it should happen when browsing in IE without enabling compat view either. If IE11 is displaying them correctly, then Maxthon isn't using Standard Rendering as you have said. 9 hours ago, SnowLeopard said: I'm posting because I'm a little bit perfectionist. That's great, but at some point good is good enough. Maxthon can't do anything about the IPB code not working with an IE8 core. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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